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#355196 18/08/08 09:58 PM
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Is there going to be a video showing it? Or images taken? Being in the US I doubt I'll be able to attend.

Do we have a cry-baby smilie by chance?
2nd thought... would it be called a frownie instead of a smilie?


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There'll be a video of div2 coming soon... wink

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Thanks for letting me know. As it is, I'm visiting here first thing after work.

I probably should re-play Sword of Lies in the near future.


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The video was shown outside of the DTP booth. However I only saw it at the booth in the Business Center and you need a press pass to access that. It is a great looking video smile
Had a meeting with Lar and he showed me the game in a half hour session. I was impressed. I'm writing an article for RPGWatch over the weekend, so I'm not going to tell it all here, but they really advanced the game compared to Divine Dvinity.


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/me cries out in agony
"where's the bootleg..."


It's one of these days...
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Impatiently waiting... cheer

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Originally Posted by lynn
Impatiently waiting... cheer


oh, thought you would be the booth babe there...


It's one of these days...
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I became too old! laugh

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you're only as young as you feel wink

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nonsense


It's one of these days...
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i wonder what been poblished.
an intro movie + first look in the "demo"? pictures?
saying the game has improved from div1 is obvious, since it is 3d and more..

i want to compare it to other games ive had or seen. :o
(in 1 picture i've spoted, the game looked much like age of conan :|)
---
that reminds me.. lynn's gona have her own 3D image in the game :o.
are we gona save you again from the evil bugs, lynn? ;D

Last edited by thirion; 22/08/08 04:48 PM.
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Originally Posted by Lar_q
There'll be a video of div2 coming soon... wink


Soon? that's not soon enough


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Maxima omnium virtutum est patientia

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Fry: Uh, could I have some Slurm please?
Glermo: No food or drink allowed on the tour. You'll have to wait until you're partying with Slurms McKenzie.
Fry: When will that be?
Glermo: Soon enough.
Fry: That's not soon enough!


Btw, have fun at the GC and oggle the booth babes to much. Wish I was there.



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Oh... Futurama... I didn't remember that quote.
Mine is from Cato the Elder btw.

We also wish we were there, you know. But only Lar is/was.
We're too busy making the game of your dreams wink

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Originally Posted by thirion
i wonder what been poblished.
an intro movie + first look in the "demo"? pictures?
saying the game has improved from div1 is obvious, since it is 3d and more..

It's not just the graphics actually, although those also improved with respect to DD wink

Last edited by Myrthos; 22/08/08 08:44 PM.

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I put this in this thread:

I was on Friday at the Games Convention and make this little video (3 parts) from the presentation:

- http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FAIxc7XnJZc

- http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HDN_j48jenQ

- http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0HncSduLIvA

Have fun laugh

If somebody need a better quality - ask me and I could maybe offer it, but not public.


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Thanks Xan smile I hope you've enjoyed the day although you've filmed so much wink

I've only watched the first few minutes because I didn't want to be spoilered too much, but what I found a little irritating: Why does the main character somersault so much? He's wearing a huge two-hander (could also be a three-hander) on his back, so somersaulting should be extremely difficult, nothing you constantly do for fun. And while some may say it looks cool, I'd say it looks rather silly. I somehow hope doing this won't be a mandatory part of the game.

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Many thanks, Xanlosch!

I assume this was the console version being demonstrated... I hope that, at least with the PC version, it will be possible for the main character to walk sometimes, and not run and leap about constantly. As Lurker said, the jumping around does get a wee bit irritating after a while! smile

What wasn't mentioned -- or at least, I didn't notice any mention -- was whether div2 allows as much interaction with the game world as div did. Can you pick all sorts of things up and move them around, and perhaps even throw them at people?

And can you sit down at a table in the tavern and have a drink with your companions? (A nice way to relax sometimes, instead of just sleeping... wink )



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Originally Posted by Xanlosch
I put this in this thread:

I was on Friday at the Games Convention and make this little video (3 parts) from the presentation:

- http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FAIxc7XnJZc

- http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HDN_j48jenQ

- http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0HncSduLIvA

Have fun laugh

If somebody need a better quality - ask me and I could maybe offer it, but not public.

Thanks very much for these video guy...:)
I'm seeing them wink

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I don't much care for the close up actiony gameplay. I was hoping for a view and gameplay similar to the original DD.

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Lurker, the character somersaults when he jumps over stuff. I also think it looks a little silly doing this, but it is probably something that you would easily get used to and just ignore. In the presentation there is less jumping after the first few minutes.

BTW, part 3 shows the character in dragon form.

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I don't like that GUI, I don't like when the character somersaults as an idiot(...and why do he do that!?...),I don't like that developers are developing this game also for x360 (no offense... wink )...

...but I love this game...
thankyou

Last edited by juanpablo87; 23/08/08 01:35 AM.
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I'm usually turned off with games like this. The flipping of the main character just annoys me after 2 hours. Stuff like this has repelled me from fighting games like Mortal Combat which I used to love.

Does the male version of the character act like sonic the hedgehog?

Not wanting to be negative, but if I didn't know of the first game. I would have definitely passed it up.

I'm not trying to be a smart ass, but what exactly is the logic of having the main character act this way in combat or just plain jumping over a ditch?

I love the idea of transforming into a dragon though.

Last edited by LightningLockey; 23/08/08 02:21 AM.

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i got couple of questions about the game..
are there gona be some earth-running mount?
will we have a special running skill, that increase running speed?
and how many beer models is this game gona have? XD

from what i've seen in the movies, this is really different then div1. in div1 you had perfect control over the whole "world". this look like adventuring.. sort of Dungeon siege with better quality. you start from 1 point and end in the last point, no going back for revisiting and what not :P
but it might be too early to joudge, since i havent played at myself..

its 5:30 am and i havent slept.. GOOD NIGHT!

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Good Night...see you tomorrow...


It's 4.53 a.m.:
I go to sleep too XD...

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I think you guys are overreacting a little bit. It's not like doing a flip will affect gameplay. I guess it might be a little silly, but it sure beats the way people jumped in say Oblivion for instance. their legs just stop moving and they fly in the air. To be honest, watching anybody run and jump looks a little silly to me. I just kinda wish that in the animation when he landed the character leaned forward a little bit while his legs caught up to him so he would look like he has weight. Anyway, just my thoughts. And I agree the dragon looks amazing, I rewound and watched that part about 3 times. One more thing, I really hope they keep the same inventory system as the last two games, where the only limit to what you can carry is weight, not slots or squares like some other games.

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party Thanks Xanlosch! Looks great. The dragon especially looks impressive and promising! Oh, and love the nonstop hip-hop background music, Kirill's style sure has changed. silly

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Everyone is saying something about the jumping and the running.

I like it. How many games Haven't I played where suddenly the character can't jump over a branch or a slight high sloped cliff. And don't we always use the "always run" button when playing? If you want a walksim play oblivion. Personally I like the fast pace of the game and it's not like we are dealing with a no depth rpg with all the choices you can make. Like Lar said, dragon flight looks so much cooler then horse riding. After seeing this I am very much impressed. The only thing I missed is the pets in the village (get rid of those pesky cats!!!!)

The mindreading option, is there a negative when reading peoples mind? Can some people detect it and get angry at you? Or does it require skill points to read certain people's mind? I only ask since when you can do it all the time it is just an other dialogue option that you use in every conversation. Looks to me like the mind reading option could be humorous. (mind reading a drunk who's trying to impress the barmaind ... silly )

Are the negatives and the positives equal? Is the magic amulet powerful enough to take the punishment of higher prices?



PS: div2 would play incredible with the wiimote I think. Looks a bit like Zelda but then in RPG-form instead of adventure. And coming from a Zelda fan that is one of the highest complements you can get smile

Last edited by Morbo; 23/08/08 08:29 AM.

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Pretty nice movie, I think it was a good presentation, although the off-screen hiphop party was kind of annoying. The second part is the most interesting one, because it focusses on the quest branching. Be sure to watch that one.

About the running/juming, Lar demonstrated +3hrs of gameplay in half an hour. It's probably an understatement when I say that he had to rush things wink. Concerning the jumping, it's not something you are forced to do, you can just as well walk around the village and stroll through the gate. But again, those things take up demonstration time ... and I think Lar just likes to jump around a lot silly

@Xanlosch: nice job man smile ... one small remark though, there seems to be a problem with the sound in the third movie

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For me the game feels very much like "Fable". But I'm really glad to see that the game still offers some very deep dialogs! The mindreading skill added dialog options are pretty cool, I guess you need there some kind of energy/mana for it? Because at one point Swen had to use the ingame console :P

Anyway, the "standing around" NPCs...look like a new trend for RPGs. Imho this doesn't feel like they're really "living" in their town(s). I know at the part with the blacksmith + girlfriend they were moving around...but only in circles? Plus I'm not quite sure yet if I like the "!" and "?" emoticons above them badsmile .

At the end the surprise with transforming the main character into a dragon is pretty awesome, something like that wasn't available before in a RPG (to my knowledge). I wonder if the player will be really able to use that skill in special areas only or whereever he/she wants.

Things I also like very much:
- presentation quality itself
- graphics are pretty top, the game feels "fast" and "smooth"
- fast (!) loading times between areas
- interesting low system requirements...sounds for me like not another console port up
- looks like Swen played with mouse+keyboard combo...I fear I had to use a gamepad :P

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Originally Posted by Koen
... although the off-screen hiphop party was kind of annoying ...


I wish I had the power and a program to remove this hiphop sounds frown

Originally Posted by Koen
@Xanlosch: nice job man smile ... one small remark though, there seems to be a problem with the sound in the third movie


Somebody else reported this problem me too. I didn't notice last night frown It is a problem in the raw data of part 3 and I don't know what happen wrong frown Maybe I must cut the whole data again and let the PC more time to synchronize audio and video. But this could be done in a few days. I think if it not a problem to hear Lar with an other voice wink



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Originally Posted by Tenorek
I think you guys are overreacting a little bit. It's not like doing a flip will affect gameplay. I guess it might be a little silly, but it sure beats the way people jumped in say Oblivion for instance. their legs just stop moving and they fly in the air.


It isn't an over-reaction. Everything else combat, run and swim wise I've seen looks great. But there is just something about the main character's normal jump that reminds me of a blue hedgehog. As for oblivian, I'd call that a bug or poor quality assurance.

As for the ! and ? over npc's. That is common in new mmorpg's to signal that npc offers a quest. And if this game will have npc's like the last one. It will be for our best interest that we keep the ! and ? to find the quest npc's easily again. When the quest is done, they will go away.


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-Thanks a lot for those videos Xanlosh smile

-About what you saw during the presentation : to be brief, lots of elements are still to be tweaked/ added / changed/ reworked etc... there were so many things we wanted fixed before showing it, but hey... we can only work at inhuman speed to make your favorite game come true wink

Have a good week-end everyone !



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Yeah i have to admit the jumping looks a bit silly, especially with a 2hander strapped on your back.
Then again like someone said before, it sure beats oblivion's jumping animation.
Only watched the first bit of the first movie cause i don't want any spoilers smile
Game looks amazing though, i hope the engine is smooth and by that i mean been oiled to not demand to much of a system.

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if it bother every one with the jumping.
it can be changed with other types of jump >_>; make the spinning a 30% chance to happen and so on...

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Originally Posted by thirion
if it bother every one with the jumping.
it can be changed with other types of jump >_>; make the spinning a 30% chance to happen and so on...


How do you know that for sure?
And it doesn't bother me that much, i just din't expect to see it.
If i would have a better idea i would say it but to be honest i don't.

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Let's see... I saw a bit of the first Youtube video. Hmm... not bad, although maybe the movement could be a bit more smooth. It looks pretty good, although still a little jerky, especially when he's running or jumping.

But first thing first: that chick who was talking about some "irresponsible stuff"? Her accent is awesome, man. smile Yes... the voice-acting ROCKS. Larian, hold on to the voiceactors. laugh

Edit: Also, I'd like to know if there are ways capable of blocking mind-reading, since there must be some attempts to devise methods and equipment.

Last edited by Raito; 23/08/08 05:27 PM.
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Freaker,
I pretty much skipped all the dialog (just moved the curser until it was just combat). There are a lot of neat things like creating attention to yourself for the orc's to chase you and you'll have a familiar that will help fight with you. Sort of like that zombie did in the 1st dungeon on Aleroth. The arrows look like spells though, guess it is to make it easier to see what is hitting you. Makes sense.

The combat is great, running is fast and swimming! Finally! To hell with stupid bridges! (unless over lava pits... then I'll happily use the bridge) Hopefully we get to that underwater kingdom described in the first game. As for the jumping.. hopefully there will be an option to have a more traditional approach to jumping. I'm still looking forward to this game, just apprehensive as this type of antics for main characters really does get on my nerves after a while.


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Hmmm Lightning, what underwater kingdom? I completely don't recall anything. smile

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Originally Posted by Raito
Hmmm Lightning, what underwater kingdom? I completely don't recall anything. smile


Me neither and Lightning why did you adress that to me?
Don't want to be rude but i don't understand smile

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I think he means the underwater kingdom (which may have been Atlantis) told about in the tale of Shrimpo in DD.

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Since the 3rd video shows the dragon transformation, it got me thinking about how flying creatures are usually handled in games. As in this case, it seems that flying creatures have a natural tendency to hover. Is it going to be the case that this ability to hover is reasoned away as being magical (after all, it's fantasy and that's okay)? I'm curious because it would be great if flight one day would be treated in a more natural manner with required landings instead of hovering.

Not that it matters. Dragon transformation is going to be cool enough as it is. wink

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...Watching the movies...
end...

Runs of to get a towel to clean up his drowling mess...

Waw, looks quite promessing.
Paladin Jolie as a dragon !!!!
I'm starting to lose my good rep wink
Just hope i don't need to buy a new computer to play it, since i just bought one.


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Freaker, First paragraph was to you. Rest was 'in general' actually.

As for the underwater kingdom, it was Atlantis, it was when Shrimpo was killed after you read all the graves in the correct order. It's something I've been wanting to see since Divinity.

Last edited by Macbeth; 24/08/08 06:16 PM.

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The presentation was a very good one and I had the pleasure of talking to Sven himself about the game. I am truly looking forward to Divinity 2: Ego Draconis and have written a preview about the game at Eurogamer Benelux. Everybody who can read Dutch can check out the preview.

Good work Larian, good work!

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Hi all,

Thanks for putting the videos online Xanlosch ! It's kinda funny to see myself but I'm glad that people who weren't at Leipzig get a chance to see the presentation.

Quick answers to the questions I've seen posted here:

Jumping/running - it's up to you if you jump or not, but personally, I like to jump a lot. I hate being blocked by something stupid as a fence and love the feeling of freedom it gives you to navigate the world. And yes, you can go to walk mode. The always run button was on to make the presentation move ahead.

View: On PC, it's possible to bring the camera in isometric view.

GUI: Work in progress. I knew it was a bad idea to show it, but that was the only way I was going to be able to read that letter.

Mindreading: It's a skill but I have to add that we're still debating the exact mechanics internally,

Cheers

Lar


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On PC, it's possible to bring the camera in isometric view.

Awesome up
Now I can sleep grin

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Originally Posted by Lar_q
Jumping/running - it's up to you if you jump or not, but personally, I like to jump a lot. I hate being blocked by something stupid as a fence and love the feeling of freedom it gives you to navigate the world. And yes, you can go to walk mode. The always run button was on to make the presentation move ahead.


I also like the ability to jump, cause i agree it's stupid when having to go around a little fence like your to dumb to get over it. It's just the way he jumps that's a little silly, but like i said before i can't think of a better jump myself. I would say realistic but that's easy to say, probally alot more difficult to make.

Originally Posted by Lar_q
View: On PC, it's possible to bring the camera in isometric view.


Ah very nice indeed!
I think it woulnd be a bad idea to be able to determine the zooming level with the mouse scroll in isometric. Some people like it zoomed out far, others close up and some in between. smile

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I hope that the wearers of the legendary helmet of tinfoil are protected against the mind read skill :p


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Wait, you mean that we can switch between isometric and, um, 3rd person view? That'd be awesome, like playing in isometric just to be comfortable with it and then switching to 3rd person to enjoy the landscapes and the battles and the like... yeah, that definitely sounds awesome.


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I wanna say, I love how when you talk to an NPC the camera angle changes from time to time like a movie might during a conversation. Its a really nice touch.

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Its great to hear about the isometric camera! Is the whole game playable this way? That is to say can you use the isometric view inside buildings and in dungeons?

Is the movement with WASD keys only, or can you move by clicking on a spot with the mouse?

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Originally Posted by Lar_q
Hi all,

View: On PC, it's possible to bring the camera in isometric view.


Wonderful news! I'll never choose another view if a zoomed out isometric top-down sort of view is available. Thanks for the info.

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Originally Posted by Lar_q

Quick answers to the questions I've seen posted here:

Jumping/running - it's up to you if you jump or not, but personally, I like to jump a lot. I hate being blocked by something stupid as a fence and love the feeling of freedom it gives you to navigate the world. And yes, you can go to walk mode. The always run button was on to make the presentation move ahead.


My questions/concerns were not about jumping. But it is the animation the character uses with jumping. I love to jump in games myself (Drakan, Zelda, Castlevania, etc) and was always annoyed that characters couldn't just hop over fences like in Divinity. My concern is about the character doing a flip for each jump (reminds me of sonic the hedgehog). It is just too annoying to constantly see the main character doing a flip in the air, especially with heavy armor and a 2 handed sword strapped on his back (or being weilded).

It is nice to jump over stuff, but why do a jump and flip to hop over a twig?

And I know Link does a back flip... I learned to play the game not using the back flip as it looks really stupid with a sword and shield. Sonic games are not bad, just this isn't suppose to be sonic, this is suppose to be warriors and dragons.


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Well... why not just let the guy take a "wider step" to skip over a twig or something that isn't too large?


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I am thinking more of jumping the fence instead of walking around to find the gate.


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Is the movement with WASD keys only, or can you move by clicking on a spot with the mouse?

I think it's implied that an isometric view has mouse-driven movement. Kinda defeats the purpose of having that camera view if the movement is still WASD. wink

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I have to weigh my words here wink Let me explain how PC controls currently are (and how they will stay unless playtesting shows us it's a bad idea):

You control the camera using FPS controls and move with the WASD keys - that means there's no mouse cursor on screen. The mouse cursor pops up whenever necessary, e.g. when you access your inventory or quickmappings. When you move the mouse backwards, the game zooms out to a top down view, when you move the mouse forward, the game zooms to a behind the character view (as you see in the screenshots). Left/right turns the camera.

This system works surprisingly well and allows you to quickly swap between what you could call tactical view (top view) and immersive view (behind the character). So when I said isometric, I actually meant the view just before you get into full top view. It might sound confusing but it's a lot harder to explain in text than it is when you control it.

That said, we still have to go through or playtests, so anything I write here might be erased by the feedback we'll get from the testers.

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huh... odd to say the least.

WASD movement is pretty standard, the camera movement on the mouse seems... fiddly, I mean it would adjust the camera whenever I move the mouse a little.

I've expected WASD (AD = strafing) and mouse left/right = pivoting. up/down tilting.
Camera pivoting would be a combo of button+mouse left/right.

I don't know, playtesting might prove it to be an excellent system. Tho Its standardly been done differently for a solid reason I guess.

in the end it remains to be seen.


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Controls sound good for me.

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No point and click? frown
Nah, this game is a must-buy no matter what, BUT why not assign the camera zoom in/out to the mouse wheel rather than just mouse movement? It seems like players would make small up/down movements with the mouse without necessarily intending to zoom, so the camera would be constantly zooming in and out. confused

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Originally Posted by flixerflax
No point and click? frown
Nah, this game is a must-buy no matter what, BUT why not assign the camera zoom in/out to the mouse wheel rather than just mouse movement? It seems like players would make small up/down movements with the mouse without necessarily intending to zoom, so the camera would be constantly zooming in and out. confused


Yeah maybe we are missing something but thats what i thought too..
Mouse scroll seems alot better option and it's used in most of the games.

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Hmmm... I think that mouse scroll sounds much better. :P

Moving your mouse to zoom in and out could make movement or even camera view rather jerky.

Edit: Btw, I'm glad that there is at least some color in this game, apart from the "dark and serious" look.

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Sorry, but no point and click movement with isometric view and you pretty much lose me.

WASD key movement is for FPS games, not RPG's.

Oddly enough with everybody using the buzzword immersion to plug the FPP/OTS WASD type games, I find this kind of gameplay completly non-immersive. I find myself concentrating on my fingers, and lose all connection with the character on the screen.

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Lar seemed to play the game pretty smooth with the pc controls, so let's just wait how the play-testers react to the movement and camera control system.
Has anyone ever played a game with controls like this? If not, I suggest we just wait and see, cause I myself, am very curious how this type of movement and camera control will work out for the player.


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About jumping again: Being able to jump is fine, but always doing a somersault when you jump is something I don't like, especially in full armour and with a giant weapon on your back. In SW: KotOR, you could do Jedi somersaults with full armour if you used the force, and it fitted into that game. I don't think it fits into a fantasy scenario, even less so if it isn't some special skill or spell. Okay, it wouldn't be a reason not to buy the game, but I'd consider it annoying if every character did this ... looks too much like a superhero or some Asian-style martial arts specialist in my eyes.

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If I recall correctly, someone said that there is only 30% chance he'll make the somersault, not sure though :s (the Blood and Night elves in WoW also have a x% chance to do a spin while jumping)

Lar said during the presentation that the Dragon Slayer is very agile, maybe if we get some background info during the game, it'll be explained more. (Maybe the Dragon Slayers are a kind of mutants like Witchers)

I personally prefer a somersault in full heavy armor while wielding a 2-hander than having to walk along a fence cause I'm wearing too much to jump. Heck, when playing Oblivion I can even jump over the watersurface in full Daedric and a Warhammer, somersaulting in heavy armor is at least somewhat more believable laugh


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The 30% was a suggestion by someone. I got the impression that when he jumps, he summersaults. Always. I might be wrong though, I don't mind much so I concentrated on other things during the presentation.


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Originally Posted by Lar_q
I have to weigh my words here wink Let me explain how PC controls currently are (and how they will stay unless playtesting shows us it's a bad idea):

You control the camera using FPS controls and move with the WASD keys - that means there's no mouse cursor on screen.

So I guess that leaves the mouse buttons for primary and secondary skills....
Does the scroll wheel cycle through available targets in combat? Or is there no targeting and you have to move to an appropriate position and just attack?

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Originally Posted by quasimodo
Oddly enough with everybody using the buzzword immersion to plug the FPP/OTS WASD type games, I find this kind of gameplay completly non-immersive. I find myself concentrating on my fingers, and lose all connection with the character on the screen.

You said it exactly. At first I thought it was just my lack of skill, but dedicating both hands to movement means its much more difficult to dodge attacks, switch skills, drink potions, etc. My left hand is for hitting hotkeys, dang it!

Originally Posted by Lurker
About jumping again: Being able to jump is fine, but always doing a somersault when you jump is something I don't like, especially in full armour and with a giant weapon on your back. In SW: KotOR, you could do Jedi somersaults with full armour if you used the force, and it fitted into that game. I don't think it fits into a fantasy scenario, even less so if it isn't some special skill or spell. Okay, it wouldn't be a reason not to buy the game, but I'd consider it annoying if every character did this ... looks too much like a superhero or some Asian-style martial arts specialist in my eyes.

Could care less about the jumping feature as long as it's not constantly necessary, though the asian-style oversized-giant-sword and physics-defying martial arts leaps are a turn off in a medieval style fantasy game.

Originally Posted by Raito
Btw, I'm glad that there is at least some color in this game, apart from the "dark and serious" look.

Agreed. I definitely like how the armors and environments still retain that distinctive Larian look.



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I'd really have to see the camera control in action to decide if I can work with a mouse up/down making the camera zoom in and out. The fact that camera look left/right is tied to the mouse, and the fact that it's nearly impossible to move the mouse only left/right and not forward/back when playing a game, there's going to be some unintentional zooming. That will get very annoying, very fast. It also takes away from the happy thoughts I had about the isometric, since a WASD control with a zoomed out camera doesn't work as well as the good ole point-and-click.

Will watch to see how this develops, and it's almost certainly not going to impact a purchase, but I'm feeling wary about the design now.

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Seems everyone is getting a big confused about the whole negative edge on jumping.

Everyone wants to jump over stuff and use jumping attacks. It is more on the "how" the character performs the jump that isn't liked. We want to jump, but not do constant flips during normal jumping.

Jump = awesome!
Jumping + Flip = downer frown

An exception is probably if you'd jump on an enemy, land on enemy shoulders, jump off and as you'd flip slash enemy head with sword. Though that isn't 'normal jumping over fence' it is more of a specialized skill to be trained in.

Jumping + attack-combo (that has a flip involved) = possibly really good.
Jumping + defense-combo (that has a flip involved) = possibly really good.

I hope this will make more sense in what I'm trying to get across.

As for WASD keys, I'm not too worried about that. I'm sure if it is really that bad, the current testers will mention it. Also I'm sure some kind of demo will come out in the coming months for a larger population to try the controls.


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I think we're all pretty much on the same page as far as the jumping. No one wants him to look like sonic the hedgehog. smile

Not everyone is going to be able to shrug off WASD-only movement, though.

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Yeah I have a really low tolerance for FPS type gaming, and it seems more developers are heading in that direction. I was really pleased to see Blizzard is sticking with what works for Diablo III.

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Also I'm sure some kind of demo will come out in the coming months for a larger population to try the controls.

... laugh

I hope...

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Originally Posted by flixerflax


Originally Posted by Raito
Btw, I'm glad that there is at least some color in this game, apart from the "dark and serious" look.

Agreed. I definitely like how the armors and environments still retain that distinctive Larian look.



Yeah that's a plus... smile

Hmm... I've got a suggestion here. Why not allow players to assign jumping movement to either mouse(scroll) or WASD? That should solve it, right? Since the WASD part is in, they just need to add the scroll thingy... lol.


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WASD is great as far as I'm concerned. But I do agree that using the mouse wheel will feel more natural for zooming in and out. But, I will play it however I have to.

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Originally Posted by flixerflax
Not everyone is going to be able to shrug off WASD-only movement, though.

The game will hopefully allow you to remap the keys; if I had to use keys for movement, the arrow keys would work better than WASD (unless you need to use the mouse at the same time). That is what I did for I of the Dragon, IIRC; remapped the keys so I used my right hand for movement, and left for attack, skill selection, etc (with the following camera I rarely needed to use the mouse to change the camera angle, and I could pause or hover whenever I needed to right click a target).

In any case, I'd probably prefer to use a gamepad for moving and combat (rather than keyboard), then switch to the mouse for inventory management, etc.

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-Remapping: yes, of course wink
-Jumping: never expected this reaction, but something to think about
-Controls: Someone mentioned that it controlled well when I was presenting it, and it does, but then again I'm of course used to the system. To a certain extent it's similar to Hellgate London. If anybody played that game (regardless of what you thought of the game itself), I'd be interested in your opinions about the controls there.
-Controls(2): One reason for the WASD is because we're trying to keep the dragon controls as close as possible to the human controls, and that system turned out the best. It also works out with the cursor keys, but you're hand is fairly far away from the skill hotkeys then.

Might want to open a seperate topic to discuss controls wink


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Originally Posted by Lar_q

-Controls: Someone mentioned that it controlled well when I was presenting it, and it does, but then again I'm of course used to the system. To a certain extent it's similar to Hellgate London. If anybody played that game (regardless of what you thought of the game itself), I'd be interested in your opinions about the controls there.
-Controls(2): One reason for the WASD is because we're trying to keep the dragon controls as close as possible to the human controls, and that system turned out the best. It also works out with the cursor keys, but you're hand is fairly far away from the skill hotkeys then.

Might want to open a seperate topic to discuss controls wink



Whats the problem with using the mouse to move in isometric view?
1 hand on keyboard for skill hotkeys and 1 hand controlling the mouse..
Whats wrong with this setup?
(I haven't seen the isometric view yet i think so if someone could direct me to a screenie..)

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Originally Posted by Lar_q
-Jumping: never expected this reaction, but something to think about

The somersault looks ok with the jump/attack combo, but IMO is a little silly otherwise. Watching the first part of the convention video again, it doesn't seem as out of place as first impressions, so I probably wouldn't notice it much after playing a few hours.

Hellgate London is an action RPG which uses first person perspective, so I never even looked at it. If the demo was a tad smaller than 1.46GB I might have downloaded it to check out the controls (though I'd would have had to try it on another system to meet the requirements).

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I must say that when I first saw and played the game, I was also taken aback a tad by the athleticism of the player character. But trust me when I say that you get used to it very quickly and soon start to appreciate and enjoy the freedom - and possibilities - it brings. Now I'm of course so familiarised with it that the lack of this feature annoys me in other 1st/3rd person RPG games. The being rooted to the ground in Fable is one example.


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Popular RPG games in the past have been isometric for the simple fact that technology couldn't hack that kind of game in 3D person or even 1st...

There is no such thing as RPG's are supposed to be isometric. I'm personally not a fan of these kind of games in 1st person, but other than that, everything works. The more control over the camera the better.

And if you can shoot fireballs, why wouldn't you be able to jump around like a Shoalin master?


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Originally Posted by Freaker98
Whats the problem with using the mouse to move in isometric view?
1 hand on keyboard for skill hotkeys and 1 hand controlling the mouse..
Whats wrong with this setup?


Well, for the human it might work, but have you ever tried this in a game where you control a flying creature that moves in three dimensions instead of just two? How will you fly up and down? We have some pretty cool environments where you can fly through, that would be impossible to navigate on point-and-click.

Now, we might split up the controls for human and dragon, but like Lar said: we'd like to keep the controls uniform for both, otherwise the transformation from human to dragon and vice versa would never be smooth enough and you'll actually have to master two control schemes.

Trust me, we've tried several approaches and the keyboard-controlled movement with mouse-controlled camera has by far been the best, most intuitive, and user-friendliest solution.


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Originally Posted by Sektor
Well, for the human it might work, but have you ever tried this in a game where you control a flying creature that moves in three dimensions instead of just two? How will you fly up and down? We have some pretty cool environments where you can fly through, that would be impossible to navigate on point-and-click.

Now, we might split up the controls for human and dragon, but like Lar said: we'd like to keep the controls uniform for both, otherwise the transformation from human to dragon and vice versa would never be smooth enough and you'll actually have to master two control schemes.

Trust me, we've tried several approaches and the keyboard-controlled movement with mouse-controlled camera has by far been the best, most intuitive, and user-friendliest solution.


Hmm i wish i could try it to see how it is.
Then i would know what needs improvement or if it's good already.
We will just have to wait and see.
And if something needs improvement or some such there are always patches smile

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Originally Posted by Sektor
Well, for the human it might work, but have you ever tried this in a game where you control a flying creature that moves in three dimensions instead of just two? How will you fly up and down?

Yes, 'I of the Dragon'. Page Up and Page Down (IIRC) changed your elevation, while clicking anywhere on the ground would have your character fly there at the current height. Most of the time you did not need to move in 3 dimensions at the same time, though there were a couple creatures who's attacks could only be avoided if you turned hard while either climbing or diving.

I usually used the keyboard to control flying, though, rather than point and click. There was no isometric camera angle; between 1st person, 3rd person and a following camera, I found the latter worked best (the 3rd person camera did not automatically turn with your dragon). With the following camera, though, you may have to change the angle higher to be able to click accurately on the ground somewhere, each time you wanted to change direction (no click and hold to direct your dragon's movement). I found it easier to just use the arrow keys, which gave better control over movement (and with the following camera provided a more visceral experience).

While keyboard controls worked great for flying, where you only need forward/stop and left/right to be able to move and hit another key to attack (with an auto-targeting system), it doesn't necessarily work well for finer control (at least not for someone who doesn't play FPS games). I've played a couple adventure games where movement was keyboard controlled and facing the right direction to talk to someone, etc, could be a pain.
You have not described combat yet, but even with just the character movement I think I would find a gamepad probably had better control and would be easier on my hands/wrists.

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The Games Convention trailer is out. I found it on Gamers Hell, but it probably will be available on other places as well.


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If I had the option for iso view/ mouse click movement for ground travel only, I would not fly at all.

The Witcher got it right when they included both options: OTS/ WASD key AND iso/ point and click.

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Some of you seem to think that if you have your hand on WASD you can't push any other buttons on the keyboard. The # keys are right above WASD, so you put your combat skills in the number buttons on the left for fast switching, and less reflexive skills like lockpicking to the right. FPS games have been doing this for as long as I can remember, its not hard to switch skills/weapons using WASD, trust me, I play them all the time. This is all assuming that the hotkeys will be the number keys not the function keys, which would be only slightly less swift. Not to mention that it sounds like the mouse wheel is freed up to flip through skills rapidly as well.

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Originally Posted by Raze
but even with just the character movement I think I would find a gamepad probably had better control and would be easier on my hands/wrists.

Yes, good idea. Assuming it's an option for PC and if my gamepad is responsive enough I may likely just play it that way.

Originally Posted by Tenorek
FPS games have been doing this for as long as I can remember, its not hard to switch skills/weapons using WASD, trust me, I play them all the time.

That's probably why it's easy for you. wink I very rarely play games with these controls, so really I'm just griping about being pushed out of my comfort zone. well

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Well I'll follow the game developements with interest, but I suspect the gameplay will be a little too action oriented for my arthritic old fingers.

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About the controls : I'd have a kind of mouse sensitivity slider implemented, if possible.
The "backstory" of this is that Drakensang is too sensitive for many people. There had been *lots* of complaints first.

I myself needed a very long time to adjust myself to it, but i think I've accustomed to it right now.

But anyway, I assume that some people will have fewer and some more problems with it.


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Speaking of Drakensang, what about anti-aliasing?

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Well, it's complicated.

Anti-Aliasing should definitively be possible in Drakensang, but in fact it doesn't quite work.

If I remember this correctly, it will be kind of omplementted with a new patch.

Some people report that renaming the .exe file in for example bioshock.exe makes the NVidia driver think it is just Bioshock and thus the driver enables Anti-Aliasing for it - with this trick you can have it in the game.

I don't know too much about it, and I think the Drakensang forum is better for finding an answer.

It's complicated.



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Originally Posted by AlrikFassbauer

Some people report that renaming the .exe file in for example bioshock.exe makes the NVidia driver think it is just Bioshock and thus the driver enables Anti-Aliasing for it - with this trick you can have it in the game.

I know. I tried that in many ways and (almost) all of the other tips as well, but it doesn't work for me. Now I'm just waiting for the patch that will fix it.

@ Larian:
Now you see what you force the player to do if you miss that AA-thing? wink

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Don't worry: AA is already supported in game.




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What about 1920*1200 resolution. And what type of minimap will be used?


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What wiil be the max resolution supported by div2?


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Originally Posted by Morbo
What about 1920*1200 resolution.


Can't imagine it not being supported these days. If widescreen resolutions of 16:10 are supported, then it's a go. I've been playing games for a very long time at 1920x1200 on my primary 24" widescreen display (I have a dual-display setup).

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I'd like to have a 480x600 resolution.

wink


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